by Rev. Smith
The other day, “Roth Harbard” aka Malachi posted about the problematic nature of mixed race marriages. I thought the comments were a mix of gentle push back and irrelevant “whataboutism.” Roth emailed and we had a pleasant and fruitful discussion. With his permission, I’m sharing some of our exchange. We covered both the inter-faith issue and the mixed-marriage issue.
My background: I am a Christian. I’m a prison, hospital, and police chaplain. In the 30+ years of this work I have interacted with hundreds who do not share my Christian faith, including officers who are Wiccan and Norse pagans. Also, I’m a staunch Anglican who enjoys reverent liturgy, while rubbing elbows all day with folks of no faith or having low-church worship styles such as Pentecostals and Baptists. I’ve developed thick skin. Working in this space has taught me to start with looking for sincerity and character. This allows the start of dialogue and sharing of perspectives not hindered by defensiveness and misunderstanding. Example, when someone tells me they are an atheist, I usually reply, “Tell me about the god you don’t believe in because I probably don’t believe in him either.”
I started my email reply to Roth:
Thanks for reaching out. You hit on a key matter and that is that pagans and Christians need to find a way to work together. When the time comes, there will indeed be an “ecumenism of the trenches” that focuses on common objectives. So why don’t we start by working on this now? I love history and am proud of my Celtic and Germanic heritage, so I enjoy discussing things with my pagan friends.
People lament that the Left practices solidarity while the Right fractures at the drop of a hat… Then they go on to argue with their brothers on the Right about stuff not relevant to our common cause. Do you see the problem with this? One of the Church Fathers said, “In essentials unity, in non-essentials liberty, and in all things charity.” What a thought! Making common cause with folks who don’t ascribe to our every belief! Of course, faith essentials are not up for debate, but we’re talking about organizing a dissident Right cause to take back culture and protect our kids, not hammering out a creed. I’ve never met Baptist canned goods or a pagan First Aid kit. These essentials are needed and should be offered to our brothers in the struggle, regardless of faith perspective.
I went on to discuss some of the “why” of misunderstanding and defensiveness:
I have found that the best way for me to keep this open-mindedness in front of me is to look at intentions, sincerity, and fundamental orientation. If you’re trying to protect the traditional family and save Western civilization then you are my brother. Even if you worship in a different way for a different god. I look for the points of agreement. And as a prison chaplain… I have developed a pretty good eye for religious zeal that’s in service to propping up ego. So I try not to get “riled up.” I see such folks as motivated by fear and in need of help, not derision. They are brusque with others at times because they are still trying to convince themselves. If I show them God’s love then their need to make a “strong presentation” is lessened and we can just talk man to man.
So, back to the matter of cooperation among pagans and Christians… The hard part is that one of the dissident Right’s biggest needs is extremely close bonds of fellowship to weed out losers and enemies, and to harden us for what lies ahead. Issue is, religious bonds are the main way people forge these strong commitments. A difference in faith makes cooperation more difficult. But again, we can choose to focus on common objectives. I am not sure how to further this mutual understanding and respect… But efforts to this end should take place… somebody’s gonna have to work on this someday.
Finally, I responded to Roth’s specific point regarding racial inter-marriage:
Now, it seems your post had an element of concern about racial mixing as problematic. You can certainly raise this concern, but most Christians … don’t think in terms of human biodiversity. “Noticing” the downside is not encouraged and a good deal of these folks have an almost allergic reaction to even mentioning kinship as a common good to be honored. Efforts to call attention to the blessings of kinship will require a lot of patience and creatively educating others. You certainly have an audience on the NCR site and may sway some to this understanding. I will pipe up from time to time in your comments and try to fairly call it as I see it.
My approach to race relations and inter-marriage differs significantly from Roth’s. (If I understand correctly, he advocates for racial separatism while I do not). In my reply I chose to search for common ground. You see, I share his concerns but not all his solutions. (Before you call me out for openly stating the downside of diversity, answer me this – How many of you live in a Haitian, Venezuelan, or Congolese enclave? I thought so. Let’s be honest – When us “normie” conservatives move to the country we are not secret racists. And it’s also true that when our Norse pagan brothers talk about the value of kinship they are not advocating white supremacy.
I concluded with my reason for not sharing his view on racial separatism:
I am fascinated by our European heritage and appreciate the efforts of those promoting solidarity and respect. But an ethnostate and rigid separations are not to my liking. I am too captivated by the vision of the New Jerusalem… That home, according to Revelation 21, into which the “kings of the earth shall bring their glory.”
23 And the city has no need of sun or moon to shine on it, for the glory of God gives it light, and its lamp is the Lamb. 24 By its light will the nations walk, and the kings of the earth will bring their glory into it, 25 and its gates will never be shut by day—and there will be no night there.
There is a glory proper to each ethne or nation. God ordained this and their kings’ glory will be welcome and honored in the holy city.
I have enjoyed writing this reply and again, thanks for reaching out. I’m thinking this type of dialogue is really needed…
Tim J. Smith, M.Div.
Chaplain, Multi-County Correctional Center
